Introduction
In an engaging episode of the ‘Scroll Sessions’ podcast, hosts Dan Page and Shane Hickenlooper welcomed digital marketing expert and mental health advocate Justin Brey (JB). The conversation offered a deep dive into JB’s journey in digital marketing, his personal struggles with mental health, and the interplay between professional life and personal well-being.
JB’s Journey in Digital Marketing
JB’s path in digital marketing started with a passion for creativity and entrepreneurship. Initially drawn to graphic design, he pursued digital marketing after the financial constraints kept him from attending the Art Institute. His journey took him through various stages, from freelancing to working in agencies and ultimately in-house roles, learning and evolving along the way.
The Balance Between Work and Personal Life
One of the key themes of the conversation was the balance between professional endeavors and personal life. JB shared his experiences with the challenges and pressures of agency life, managing numerous brands and a team of ad buyers. He reflected on the importance of staying passionate and curious, emphasizing the ever-changing nature of digital marketing.
Mental Health Struggles and Recovery
A significant part of JB’s story was his candid sharing of his mental health struggles. He opened up about reaching a point of severe personal crisis, including thoughts of suicide, and how he managed to turn his life around. The turning point came from realizing the importance of family, re-aligning his priorities, and seeking therapy.
Mental Health in the Workplace
The podcast underscored the critical importance of addressing mental health in the workplace. JB’s story is a testament to the impact that personal struggles can have on professional life and vice versa. It highlighted the need for supportive work environments where mental health is taken seriously, and employees feel comfortable discussing their challenges.
Looking to the Future
Looking ahead, JB expressed his commitment to continue growing in the digital marketing field and his ongoing efforts to support mental health awareness. He talked about his new venture, Here Brotherhood Co., focused on creating a platform for men to discuss mental health issues and support each other.
Conclusion
Justin Brey’s journey is a powerful reminder of the complex interplay between our professional lives and personal well-being. His story on the ‘Scroll Sessions’ podcast provides valuable insights for anyone navigating the challenges of a demanding career while maintaining mental health and personal relationships.
Listeners can find more of Justin Brey’s insights and follow his journey on LinkedIn, where he actively shares his experiences and thoughts on digital marketing and mental health.
https://www.linkedin.com/in/justinbrey/
[Music] welcome to scroll sessions everybody uh we’re excited to be here
0:09
today we’ve got an awesome guest JB and I’m here with my co-host Dan Page
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JB why don’t you uh introduce yourself a little bit give us a little bit of background on who you are yeah for sure I’m stoked to beer I don’t know if I’m qualified to be on this podcast but
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we’re not qualified yeah we are not qualified to run one so we’re in good you’re in a good company
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yeah I mean just a little bit about myself is I’ve been in digital marketing for I guess professionally for like seven or eight years but unprofessionally like ever since I
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graduated high school pretty much I’ve just been always very like entrepreneurial driven and
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um creative focused I started out in graphic design okay that’s I love drawing and stuff and
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kind of like my love for drawing and creativity I was I was accepted at um the Art Institute if you guys okay cool you know what that was for graphic design wow but
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um it was too expensive so I didn’t go and wait is this the Art Institute of Chicago no it’s in
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like San Diego okay or San Francisco one of the Sands yeah yeah it’s funny because I remember
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and this is a small side tangent Kanye West once tweeted he’s like I’m going to teach a class at
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the Art Institute of Chicago and then the Art Institute of Chicago tweeted back and said no you’re not and I thought it was like the funniest thing I’d ever heard anyway that’s a sign that’s
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a side note but they might have one in Chicago but um anyways yeah so like I it was one of those
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things where you just like brought in I was never very um like I hated school and stuff so I going the art path was like what I wanted to do yeah yeah and um it was one of those things where you
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like went in and instead of like them looking at your grades they looked at your artwork and so I brought in all these like drawings that I shared and they’re like we’d love to like have you and
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accept you and how cool and it was cool but it was just too expensive and so didn’t end up doing that
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um ended up uh going on a mission and coming back LDS mission sure yeah that’s what that is
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um where’d you serve in South Africa okay very cool we’ve got people that work at scroll that served in uh Ghana and where was the other one uh it starts with an L Liberia it’s right next
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to Ghana oh cool yeah yeah sweet which I guess is more like Western right yeah so yeah I was
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you were very sorry yeah it’s a continent I was I was in Johannesburg and then like cape
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Town’s like even you know at the very Coast but one of the founders of film lab served in
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Mitch tallmadge’s brother right there served in South Africa oh really yeah actually most of it was in Botswana okay very very I think it’s its own mission yeah yeah
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but anyways got back got kind of back into graphic design so I mainly started doing like
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just freelance stuff like yeah graphic design and things like that and that like kind of my love
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for creativity and Entrepreneurship and business just kind of led to digital marketing I guess and that’s what I ended up getting my degree in at UVU which took me 12 years to get that’s awesome
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really still don’t have mine okay well yeah I um I like I said I just school’s never really been
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my thing and I I dropped out several times to try to start businesses and then I would come back and
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anyways I finally did it which congrats I guess is cool yeah yeah I finally finished my degree last
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year too it it’s not it’s when you’re close enough it’s like you may as well that’s like the position
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because I was already in like the industry and I was already like pretty well established but I had my wife was like you only have like three semesters like just finish yeah yeah so I was like
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fine fine I’ll do it wives for you why well I just have that uh have that tendency to do that they do
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and so motivators of the world yeah if I had to do it over again I probably honestly and I maybe this
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sounds bad but I I don’t think I would have gone to college yeah yeah I remember when I started at um one of the agencies I worked at there was a kid there who was like 19 and he wasn’t getting paid
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a ton but at 19 years old he’s working in agency and agencies are the best way to get experience 100 in marketing for sure because yeah you’re just constantly working with different brands
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and things like that and I’m like that kid by the time he’s my age which is almost 32 he’s just gonna be exceptional so much further yeah I am amazing yeah and I mean they say that like if you
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want to make six figures learn a craft right yeah and media buying or graphic design if you can get
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exceptional at one of those things then you’re so valuable I mean even scroll right now we’re
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looking for a really high quality ad buyer that has managed Enterprise accounts and it’s hard to
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find one that is worth working yeah and but when you do they’re worth their weight in gold so and
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a lot of them it’s just simply because they’ve had experience and speaking on that like I yesterday I
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went to a lunch with this uh 16 year old kid and his dad that you lived in my neighborhood and the
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kids interested in digital marketing and he’s like I don’t want to like flip burgers at McDonald’s in
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high school like I want to start a Drop Shipping Store I want to start like an SM a a agency like
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I just want to like get into it and I’m like dude like just take the summer learn everything you can
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learn and like start trying to get clients yeah because literally because you will be so far ahead
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of all of your peers in high school and work for free or yeah you know they’re very cheap right
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for the cost of working at McDonald’s yeah yeah totally 100 yeah because when you’re when you’re that young it’s like what do you I mean obviously you want money but it’s a different situation when
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you have like a wife and kids and a mortgage yeah it’s very different you know like I was me and my wife were very poor for most of our yes yeah yeah we got married really young we had kids
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really young and you know she was a teacher and it’s like I know teachers make amazing money my
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wife was a teacher yeah we were crushing it but yeah so um anyways I I don’t I don’t know if I
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regret going to school like I I think it would be cool one day to like be a professor or something I really like teaching a lot and yeah and I’ve been a lot more active on LinkedIn lately one of
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my favorite things is like students hitting me up or something and asking me for like career advice and I realized how much like I enjoy that and love it for sure and so I always feel like doing like
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some sort of um just giving back somehow yeah what is it called though when like there’s a professor yeah adjunct or associate yeah like I think doing something like that would be super
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cool I agree and always have to get my degree yeah yeah a lot of those a lot of those places
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saw some of them I think it depends on how much experience you’ve had yeah versus like if you’ve
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got maybe a little experience and they want you to have a degree I think it depends on who you it’s like Bill Gates having a dog doctorate right like he didn’t actually get a doctorate
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they just gave him that yeah yeah they’re like you deserve this which they that’s real yeah
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oh it’s mind-blowing professors have a degree no no no I went to enzyme College ldsbc in Salt Lake
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and a lot of their associate professors I think they require you to have some sort of degree at
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a bare minimum um but that I remember taking classes from a guy who I don’t even think had
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a degree but he was a CMO at a company yeah and those those were the best teachers because one
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of the issues in college that I found especially with marketing and probably any subject nowadays is just how out of like touch and out of date they are Theory I just thought yeah you’re just
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talking about high level theory for the most part you’re not actually like talking about things just Advance yeah like nowadays it’s like a week the thing with marketing and and creativity and stuff
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it changes on sometimes like a weekly basis on a dime yeah yeah and I was I was currently in the field when I was in school finishing up my last three semesters and I had professors that
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were teaching things and I was like that’s not true yeah like that doesn’t work anymore yeah for sure like you’re already behind you know because you were running an agency five years ago and you
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think that those Concepts apply to today yeah and I feel like for back in the olden days before the internet that was probably true there probably was years where it was a similar strategy but now with
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the Internet it’s just like changing changes all the time so why are you so interested in teaching
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I don’t know I think I just find like a genuine join it like it wouldn’t be about the money for me
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um fulfillment yeah I guess like I when I when I started getting more traction on LinkedIn I was like my first thought which is I guess kind of terrible I was like how do I make money from
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this yeah of course I guess yeah especially if you’re an owner if you’re a business owner yeah
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yeah like that’s like where my mind went so I was like I’m gonna open up like a Consulting thing so I I don’t know if you guys heard of volley but I started doing like Consulting on volley and
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I started charging people for like having calls with me like students and stuff didn’t have much
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money and I just started to feel bad I was like it wasn’t as fulfilling and so I I took it down and
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I just started talking like for free I was like this is yeah I just like I didn’t necessarily need the money not that I’m like flush with cash but like yeah yeah like I I enjoy doing it enough for
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free yeah so that’s awesome and it’s definitely fulfilling for sure I feel you on that I think
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like right now I I just got a a member position with Davis Technical College oh cool and I’m
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that’s like my first maybe intro into like giving back to the community because I’m from Kaysville that college is based in Kaysville and I’m excited to give back there I guess finally I knew one of
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the professors and she reached out it’s kind of I didn’t even reach out she reached out to me and was like Hey we’re looking for agency owners we would love to like have you be a part of the
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board to help us develop our curriculum make sure make sure we’re like keeping up with the trends
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right and that we only meet like once or twice a year and I’m like and everything changes in six months exactly so I’m like well I we we’re gonna we’re gonna have to guess a little bit in
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the future you know for curriculum’s sake but I’m excited about that yeah stuff like that would be awesome and that’s that’s another point to college I think is good is like networking yes right for
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sure like a lot of people are like everyone got my masters to network right and so like I did I definitely did make a lot of good connections so I feel like there definitely are benefits but I
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remember I got a call from UVU like a few months after I graduated and he’s like hey he’s like I’m just doing a survey about like UVU and marketing students and he’s like he’s like how what would
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you how much has applied to you since you started your career and I was like maybe two percent he was like oh he’s like you must have you must have gone into a different field than
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what you graduated I was like no I graduated in digital marketing and I’m in digital marketing yeah crazy I think uh so on LinkedIn you talk a lot about mental health yeah do you feel like uh
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teaching helps with mental health or sharing with others that that helps with mental health for you the mental health aspects I feel like because like I I’ve been on LinkedIn for a little while
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but I just started so like the very first post I did that like blew up was a photo it was in
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December so I haven’t really been Super Active since until December it was a photo of my wife reading scriptures to our kids in the morning and it just like blew up yeah and I was like what the
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hell is going on yeah for sure like I got like thousands of likes and tons of comments made all these connections linkedin’s very religious I guess but like maybe I’ve never wanted to go
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like that even in the post I was like I was like I don’t like talking about religion and it wasn’t really meant to be like religious it was just like this is something like I love my wife for
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I guess and I know I do love my wife I was just yeah no yeah I know I know what you meant though yeah and anyways ever since then things that you love about your life exactly and then um
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ever since then I basically started posting every day and just grew like thousands of followers over
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the span of a couple months which was cool and um then from there I started being because I used to
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just post about like marketing stuff I was like this is what’s working in marketing and no one for sure no one cared at all and then I took that and I started I guess like posting more
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personal stuff and then I started going into like my past of like my journey because like I
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went through a crazy Whirlwind of mental health and you know I mean my wife almost got divorced and you know I I had thoughts of like suicide and things like that and I overcame that and I’ve
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been really transparent about kind of that whole journey on LinkedIn and ever since I’ve done that that’s what’s really like opened up kind of the mental health yeah as soon as you’re vulnerable
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like it really I think opens up the floodgates to people to relate to you right yeah and that’s
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been really cool because I get I get hit up now by guys a lot every week and and then that’s led
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to some I don’t know if you guys know who John Moore is yeah yeah he’s uh he’s at enzyme College
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I’m actually I think I go to I’m going to lunch that’s right next week oh yeah he was like the creative director for ldsbc I think yeah he was that’s right yeah and so um yeah I like met him
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like a couple months ago and we went to lunch and then um I always think I feel like everything kind
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of happens for a reason and I was always trying to I’m like I wonder why I’m getting all this traction on LinkedIn like is there a purpose to it and then I went to lunch with John Warren and
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he talked about like an apparel brand underground mental health for men and I was like like right
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when he said that I was like this is and he’s like I want to partner with you yeah and so this is
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this hair here here here yeah it’s here yeah okay h-e-a-r-e it’s like I’m here and I’m I’m here yeah
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yeah well yeah that makes sense yeah so why do you think LinkedIn is such a good Community for
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mental health because I’ve noticed that too that Instagram doesn’t really care Tick Tock doesn’t
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really care but more about vanity and there’s definitely plenty of vanity on LinkedIn for sure
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I think there’s yeah why do you think that they would care about mental health more as a platform I think it’s just the audience on LinkedIn from what I found I’ve I’ve never um really
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enjoyed like organic social very much at all and I’ve never tried posting very much anywhere yeah
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um but what I’ve heard from LinkedIn is I’ve I genuinely feel like it’s the most authentic
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um audience like out there like I just can’t believe the conversations that you had relationships I’ve gained through Linkedin yeah it’s like it’s just it’s in such a short
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amount of time that that’s another piece of advice that I give students that reach out to me or something as I’m like start posting on LinkedIn yeah like just start and like don’t like
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just post genuine thoughts that you’re having like that’s what that’s what works on LinkedIn even in like I’ve had people come and be like this isn’t Facebook and it’s like well I got like 300
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yeah but it’s been it’s been a really like cool experience so far and um yeah it’s led
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to like doing this thing on the side with with John and obviously we both have our full-time job so it’s something we’re just solely doing on the side yeah um and yeah so we’re excited
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about it that’s really really cool yeah so do you feel like um I guess to play Devil’s
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Advocate to LinkedIn right because I post a lot on LinkedIn too I I think there’s the flip side
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of people saying it’s the least authentic because people are saying everyone’s always looking for a
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job or I get all I hit get hit up with all these spam messages oh yeah I do for sure
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how would you uh Advocate that it is more authentic than a Facebook or an Instagram
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man that’s a hard question because that is I don’t it’s hard because I don’t have much to compare it to because I’ve never tried posting much but when you look at when you look at
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someone’s personal post on LinkedIn compared to someone’s personal post typically on Instagram or
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Facebook I guess people are still on Facebook yeah yeah I don’t know we need we need them
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to release their quarterlies but yeah and then like Twitter’s a whole other animal right yeah
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um just the comments and conversations that take place um I just feel like are so much more I don’t know what am I trying to say like beneficial or
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they’re they’re more interesting conversations they’re not just like oh this is cool like thumbs up yeah for sure like people make genuine comments that you respond to and then it
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like leads to your your inbox um like last night I posted a pretty like controversial I guess go
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check it out but go check out my LinkedIn I’m just kidding um I I just I genuinely was asking
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people because there’s a whole marketing thing around like support women-owned businesses or support like this business or something I was generally encouraged because I like that form
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of messaging has never really worked for me like when someone makes their business why about their
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gender or their race it doesn’t make me want to buy their product right like I’m all about
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like the service you offer like the product like the quality and so I was curious if that form of
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marketing works for people and I did put up a poll I was like does someone’s race or gender or sexual orientation make you want to buy from them buy from them right it was it was basically
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like yes or no and from that it was just like and I and I honestly thought I was going to get a lot of like [ __ ] and like I wasn’t I like I don’t care first of all if you do then that’s fine like
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I personally don’t and you asked a question yeah it was just a question because I was just curious because I I genuinely see I mean I think you guys see it like you just see that former marketing all
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over the place yeah and only I had I don’t know how many votes I have now but I got hundreds of votes and only one person voted that they did a shop and I was like that’s just interesting to
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me that yeah yeah you see that all over the place yet it seems like most people care more about the quality and for sure and I guess it depends on your Market too right like mix hers is a brand
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here out of Utah where they Pride themselves on being female founded but their product is targeted
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towards females and like I also don’t know if I would say like because I have you guys ever read start with Why by um yeah yeah uh I know I’ve watched the YouTube video about start with why but
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I haven’t read the book okay the book’s awesome and I I would even argue that like their why is
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not necessarily like our why is we’re women out right um it’s funny we actually I actually to do
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marketing for mixers oh yeah they were a client at one of the agencies I worked at oh nice yeah
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Cool brand no awesome really cool really cool brand like what they stand for is awesome
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um and they’re obviously very centered around women and for a product like that like you probably do want it to like be oriented that way yeah you probably want a woman to own it because
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they understand the needs of women but I feel there’s a difference between like this like I’m a woman like I made this product because I wanted to help women instead of being the primary message
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being like I’m a woman like you should support me because I’m because this is a woman it’s a flip in
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the conversation yeah the story isn’t necessary buy for me because I’m a woman it’s here’s my
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experience with painful periods for example yeah exactly like if a guy comes in he’s like I made
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this product for 12 women’s periods everyone’s gonna be like I don’t know yeah like what are you talking about like you don’t know you’re talking about for sure because yeah someone experience
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that yeah and I have no problem if people do if that genuinely is what people are in I’m all
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about just like personal freedom like I just like whatever people want to do they should do like you know as long as it doesn’t hurt anyone or anything like I’m okay with it but I like the approach to
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LinkedIn of instead of pushing your agenda you ask a question and Inspire comments and I think yeah
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that’s okay but that was the point I was getting yeah and I think that’s a great approach uh
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to use LinkedIn because it can be a great source for conversation and I’ve noticed the same thing
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that I can have good dialogue with people because they’re not there trying to defend their Instagram page and followers instead they are open to a thoughtful conversation
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in the DMS because it’s not about their social network and their visibility or
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any of that yeah it’s just about it’s just literally about connecting yeah I feel like
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LinkedIn is kind of the I don’t know maybe people disagree with this but from what I can tell and like I said I don’t have a lot to compare it to because I haven’t tried much on
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other socials but I feel like it is one of like the least like kind of politically LED
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from my personal experience like I’ve posted things before that I feel like might
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like be construed yeah like kind of like that post like I thought like even though I wasn’t like let’s not support like yeah it’s like I was very just like whatever
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um I thought I was going to get a lot more negative feedback and I really didn’t and I was I was pretty surprised whereas if I feel like I put something like that on maybe like Instagram
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or something yeah it might have been like making a story yeah well I think you led the conversation the right way where the way that I have approached LinkedIn in the past has kind of been aggressive
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yeah and that leads to dialogue that’s aggressive which is my fault so I think that the way you
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approach it matters a lot and totally you approach it in a really good way so I think that that helps maybe I think IRS will typically try to add like some sort of like um comedic like elements
21:12
yeah yeah like I like I did a third option and it was like I only shop on Amazon
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um so it’s like kind of like I but I I do have I also have serious posts like I LinkedIn I’m kind
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of like uh you talked a lot of you talk a lot a lot about your family you talk a lot about your
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your own personal but history I had a post that was like pretty heavy on suicide yeah and um
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and kind of like my personal experience and like LinkedIn like censored it it was my only post that I’m pretty sure they did yeah like they were it wouldn’t surprise me they do that on most of the
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platforms when you talk about that subject yeah and so that’s and I I’ve never had that happen before but I was like usually like I started getting comments and likes pretty quickly and I
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was like what has happened like my Impressions were really low so I just head up a bunch of people I was like can you share this I was like this is and because it’s the most important
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message you’ve shared on LinkedIn yeah yeah and so stuff like that obviously I’m not like I don’t I
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try not to be like super funny but yeah for sure no it’s a serious conversation for sure but uh anyways yeah I’ve just I’ve seen a real benefit and just being very genuine and authentic on the
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platform and I feel like when I have been that way it’s just it’s lots of really good conversations and yeah I really enjoyed it yeah why I guess why do you think uh talking about your mental
22:31
health I guess as a man is really important and you’ve got you know you’ve got this brand that’s targeting men with mental health issues probably to get more awareness I guess why is
22:43
why is that important right now that’s a good question one thing one thing I realized and
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um my buddy John or I guess partner um is men like struggle talking about things a lot of
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times and not only do they struggle talking about talking about these with people but specifically like family members and their wives like it’s it’s hard for a lot of guys to to communicate
23:04
and express their emotions to people that they’re closest with which is like kind of funny yeah if you think about it because you think that that would be the only people you
23:13
should be open with yeah you know and so one thing I’ve noticed since I’ve been more open about you know like my past and things like that is I get guys hitting me up because they just
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they first of all they see me being transparent about my past and they feel like they can share with me and there’s also the component of like they don’t fully have this relationship with
23:32
me where they feel like they can be like very vulnerable yeah and open with me even though I get messages a lot that are like hey I hope you don’t judge me for this I was like I don’t even
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know you I was like so yeah but first of all like I’m not gonna judge you yeah and I feel like people when you know people struggle going to their their wives and stuff because you know
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they I think they probably care more about what they think what they think of them or you know
23:53
when you’re with someone every day or you know you see your family at Christmas like it’s just you know it’s a lot easier to talk and and to and to have conversations like that with people that
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um you don’t fully have those relationships with and so that’s that’s also kind of the purpose of what me and John are doing with here is we you know when people become members we haven’t
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opened it up yet we’re still just kind of very slowly building it but we we want to give people platform and guys to talk on like almost like a Therapy Group yeah is there going to be an
24:23
anonymous side to that yeah so like we’re we’re still kind of working it out I don’t know if you guys have heard of volley yeah yeah yeah we’re familiar with it yeah so I think we we’re leaning
24:32
towards using that platform and a big part of it is we want to keep group like private groups small
24:39
um that’s another issue we’ve seen as if like a groups get too big then guys are also like kind of scared to share and they shut down a little bit so keeping groups tight knit of like probably
24:47
20 at most in their own personal little volley group or they can either chat or do video yeah
24:53
um and you can also make those groups like pretty private as well and like pretty secure and so that’s kind of the route I think we’re going with right now
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um and then also the clothing component that I’m really excited about is um we want to build like custom limited drops t-shirts that are designed around certain men’s
25:13
stories so like interesting like the art and the stories on them will be very unique and designed
25:19
to a specific individual who has overcome mental health or suicide or drug addiction or you know whatever it may be and we’re kind of calling those guys like the heroes yeah right and
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then you know we’re going to give a really large percentage of whatever we make um to like building
25:38
um awareness around mental health you know or donating to families who’ve lost like a father or brother or things like that so that’s another company very very cool and to give some
25:49
people some context uh to your story what what is your story with mental health and how did you
25:56
get to where you are today I know that that could probably go on for hours and hours but yeah so I
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mean it started I guess it’s fairly like religious driven kind of is you know obviously I grew up LDS
26:10
um and I was never Super Active in the church but I obviously started a mission loved my mission
26:16
um got back kind of went active again got married to my wife yeah started being active again we got
26:21
like still in the temple year later and then after that like a year I was like I’m done like I’m just
26:26
done with the church and so I I left and I was I was very inactive for probably six or seven
26:32
years of our marriage okay which had its strains especially when you start having kids because you start having kind of different opinions and stuff but um not only that but I really just
26:41
started to become a very selfish individual I was just totally focused on my own needs
26:49
um I was very into fitness and I still am but I was like that was like my number one thing became
26:55
like obsessive yeah and it sounds crazy but the gym like came before my kids like my wife would get home I’d go to the gym she would put the kids down alone like yeah I was not there I
27:04
was not helping like yeah and I think back now and I’m just like anyways I was just not down
27:09
a good path I started drinking a lot I started getting into drugs um we we actually separated
27:14
twice me and my wife and so the first time we were separated for a few months and it wasn’t obviously it was serious but it wasn’t like super super serious we ended up getting back together
27:25
um just because I felt like you know we just had Grown Apart in our differences yeah we both wanted different types of people yeah and so we got back together
27:35
um the bad thing was when we got back together nothing changed right it was just like we still love each other let’s get back together nothing changed things got worse
27:42
um you know I even got more down and down and down and started getting more into alcohol and things like that and then we we really separated for about six months we we filed our divorce papers
27:52
um and then I really I the sad thing is when we when we separated the second time I wasn’t even like sad in the beginning like I was like that’s how like far gone I was yeah that’s how far like
28:02
removed you were detached I was from like what was important in life did your feelings were
28:07
around yourself they were totally centered on myself did you have kids at the time yeah we had two yeah yeah we had two we had two boys and like thinking back on it now I’ll never
28:17
forget the night we separated I remember my wife like slapped me because I was just being terrible I was doing terrible things and making lots of mistakes and I just didn’t even care like
28:27
it was just it was insane and I left and we we were separated and then uh for some reason
28:34
um well not for some reason around Christmas time you know I started thinking about my family when
28:39
I started getting a little more sad but then just started to fill my very my needs I guess
28:45
with things to make me happy for a short amount of time and then Christmas came around and my
28:51
wife started sending me pictures of my kids like opening presents and I just like lost it and I was like yeah I was like this is what am I doing yeah and then I pushed everything
28:58
out of my life I stopped doing drugs I stopped I like stopped doing alcohol I started like reading
29:03
scriptures again and praying and um I guess actually a little before that though when I
29:08
when I really hit rock bottom is I I wanted I wanted to get back together with my wife and I
29:14
was like I want this to work and she’s like there is no way in hell we’re ever getting back together like there’s just no way yeah and so that led me to you know I I drove of
29:23
um up in the mountains and I took my gun and I wrote a suicide note to my kid and she’s I was like this is it like I just I’ve you know I realized what how much I’d lost right when I
29:34
didn’t have anything in my life that was making me happy you know or happy quote-unquote yeah
29:41
um I ended up not doing it and I ended up kind of turning my life around a little bit I started like serving a lot um I started like playing the guitar at like an old folks home and I started
29:51
really trying to get out of looking at myself yeah and looking at and helping others yeah
29:56
and all this knowing that my wife my wife was still just like we’re not getting back together and then um my wife have you heard of like manifesting yeah yeah for sure I I always
30:06
thought it was kind of weird but you know I I kept being like I’m changing like I promise like I’m a different person now and she’s like I don’t care like we’re getting back together yeah and
30:15
um and I I think the good thing with with what helped us was I I actually wasn’t changing for her I was changing for me because I knew I had to change because I was just so unhappy you had that
30:26
climax in your life yeah it brought you to that that moment where you realize you had to change for yourself yeah and and that’s really what it came down to and anyways um my wife ended up going
30:37
to this manifesting class and she was like Hey do you after the class she was like hey do you mind if I come over and I was like sure there’s like no idea what you want to talk about and she’s
30:45
like let’s go sit on your beds we’re inside of my bed and she pulls out like this notebook and she’s like I want to read you something in my manifestation class and she just starts reading
30:53
um like I’m back with Justin like we have like a home like he has like a good job like we have a
31:00
like yeah all these things and I am just like in tears because I’ve been to that point I was
31:06
like we’re never getting back together like our families you know are we were a week away from our divorce papers like like we had we had signed them filed them like a week away from it being
31:16
finalized and she was like she was like I want to like try to like give this a shot and so she
31:21
gave me 90 days to make sure that I was good and then after those 90 days uh we got back together and wow and when was this so when did you get back together two and a half years ago okay ish
31:32
um and what’s crazy is the whole manifesting thing literally everything she wrote down came true yeah like it was just it was just insane to me and so it’s there’s power in putting things
31:42
out there in Words and thoughts and on paper for sure it really is and before that moment I would
31:49
I was always like I just didn’t really believe in that stuff very much yeah and then now I’m
31:54
obviously I just I couldn’t believe it like it just it was it changed my life around and
32:00
um since your life’s literally done like an entire 180 yeah in the last couple
32:06
years yeah I just I look back and I just can’t believe how far we’ve come and it’s yeah and I just it’s I’ve been very blessed since you know I kind of switched my life around and
32:15
obviously we’re not perfect like yeah it’s always a work in progress but you’re not sure I’m very
32:20
close I’m getting there well what’s I guess what’s been the biggest lesson then you’ve learned coming
32:27
going through this personal Journey that you’ve been on and now being back together with your
32:32
wife having I would say a relatively successful career from the outside like what’s been your
32:39
biggest learning experience what’s the biggest thing you’ve learned the biggest things for me um
32:44
and I don’t like too many things too religious but the biggest turnaround for me was like having an
32:49
eternal perspective on life right and I get that not everyone’s religious and that’s totally fine um I do think it’s healthy to like believe in something greater than yourself and for
32:57
me that’s God and um turning back to that helps me and having that Eternal perspective and also
33:04
um not being selfish yes for sure I think that’s I think that’s probably the biggest issue most
33:09
people have in their marriages is like you just marriage is hard yeah like it is I think everyone
33:15
that’s married can agree it’s very it’s it’s hard it’s a new decision every day to commit to love
33:21
and commit to understanding right yeah and it almost seems like it’s almost seems kind of I
33:26
don’t know for lack of ever like unnatural kind of to just be with one person you know for yeah you probably felt that way on your mission too or you’re like I’m with this one person 24 7. more
33:37
than you are with your spouse even for the most part you get home and you’re like I hated that I
33:42
just want to be alone but I want to get married and do it all over again forever yeah you know I know it’s like yeah when you’re when you’re dating obviously it’s like this is great I want to be
33:50
with you all the time and everything and then yeah you get married and you’re like oh man like they don’t really do the dishes whatever comes up yeah yeah yeah it’s like uh just all these things but
34:03
there there is there is like uh like uh something special about committing yourself I think to
34:09
one person yeah and and if you if you make it work and you put in the work every single day
34:14
um that’s really like happiness is hard work yes I love that you know like the things that
34:20
make you happy um people are like oh like what makes you happy here and it’s like the things that might be happier are the things that are so hard and sometimes are like make me mad like
34:30
my kids yeah I don’t know if you guys have kids yeah I’ve got kids but yeah yeah kids are like so I I did not know my capacity for anger until I had to chill through it
34:41
but also your capacity for Joy exactly it’s like complete opposite sides of the spectrum
34:48
right and it’s like it’s kids are so hard but then you have moments where it’s like my uh my
34:54
seven-year-old like he went to first grade and like watching him get on the bus for the first time like things like that it’s just like that’s awesome like or like a conversation
35:02
and I’m not saying you need kids or you you even need to be married to be happy I’m just saying
35:15
for me personally that’s been like the most rewarding and I think that’s probably the most happiness and realizing like for me personally that’s what I want my life to be for sure so it
35:25
seems like that’s kind of the outcome of all your struggles and you working hard to pull
35:31
through them your outcome is being able to see your kid get on the bus or you know be at home and have dinner with your family and that’s why it brings you so much joy because you have this
35:42
this awareness of oh my gosh I This Is My Success I’ve succeeded this is almost the
35:48
finish line for me of coming across those mental yeah or uh barriers yeah and it still it still
35:55
is frankly kind of a fight every day though yeah yeah for sure it’s a yeah it’s a choice you have to make every day for sure especially if you’re an addiction prone yeah and it’s so
36:04
easy to get put back in the selfish mindset like very easily totally um and so I always
36:10
have to like me and my wife also did like a lot of therapy you know yeah therapy is awesome like we
36:16
um we tried therapy before and it really is about finding the right therapist because we finally found the right one and um we did therapy separate for a while and then we did it together
36:25
also so like both aspects of it and that also just helped a ton um with our relationship and
36:32
where were you at with work amongst all this that was two and a half years ago right yeah I was doing freelance free all the time so I did freelance for a long time that’s like
36:41
how I made my living was freelance work and doing graphic design and just kind of hustling
36:47
um and then I got into like an agency and then I went to another agency and then
36:53
um yeah I worked in-house and now I work at a company called giddy Draper and was work
36:59
impacted by all this going on do you feel like sometimes I feel like people who become uh who
37:07
are struggling mentally start to over invest in work and get really committed or they’ll step away
37:14
completely and you know Finance us it will fall apart what was going on work wise for you there honestly that because you were dictating it right yeah that obviously didn’t have a huge impact at
37:24
the time the hard the hard part was was actually when we got back together because I decided to
37:29
finish my degree so we got back together while working while trying to figure out all the interpersonal relationship stuff that was going on yeah because I was I was working full-time
37:38
um and then I got a job in agency so then it was like a lot more strict rather than just freelance but the money was a little better so obviously I took it yeah and um and I continued to finish work
37:48
on the side and um so going to school full-time working full-time like I just I’m I know a lot of
37:53
people have done that but I just I look back and I liked I don’t know how in the hell like I remember driving home sometimes and just crying yeah like because I yeah I was like I I was just so like
38:06
stressed but I was also so happy like we were all back together and I was so grateful at the same time there’s a lot going on but yeah I was like working all day and then knowing that I had to
38:15
write a paper and you know um you know chat GPD or whatever yeah the CPT now can solve that problem
38:21
for you that would have been great at the time uh but yeah I just remember I don’t know I’m sure you
38:28
guys have been in like I remember I ran rag have you guys ever run Ragnar yeah yeah so I did that familiar I did that forever we’re actually in the old Ragnar offices in Caseville our office is the
38:37
older agner office so that’s that’s my I hate running with a passion but my dad was gonna do
38:44
it and he dropped out he’s like you need to take my place okay I’ll do that that’s why I did it and
38:49
um I remember after that just being so I got home after three days and I was so physically just
38:55
exhausted I sat on the bed and my wife walked in and I just started crying and she’s like why are you crying I was like I don’t know I’m just done but it was just that feeling of like you’re like
39:06
your body has hit its limit you know but yeah it so it helps you grow so do you feel like structure
39:12
was really good for you in that time you went and got a job you went to school got your family back
39:18
together do you feel like structure helped with that even though it was hard yeah for sure I think
39:23
there is a structure and that’s also a component I’ve always struggled with is because I I get I get bored really easily and I think a lot of people with like entrepreneurship minds and stuff
39:32
do get bored really easily yeah and I think I was applying it to my life because you know sometimes like living in the same place or driving the same car you know or being married to the same
39:40
person like it’s like yeah I start to just be like oh I want this and I want this yeah and
39:45
um but like I definitely there is there definitely is a good aspect of having some sort of structure
39:51
in your life I think for most people um and that definitely did help for sure yeah because I know
39:58
with you being big into fitness that structure really helped you with Fitness right because lifting weights exercising you realize over time these are the positive results I get from that and
40:09
then same thing with work you know you add some structure to work and you realize oh these are the positive results I get from that yeah yeah but very interesting to hear because being an
40:19
entrepreneur uh there’s freelance and then there’s looking for a company and they’re so different
40:26
um and I’d almost separate agency from company sometimes agencies are like five many companies
40:32
within you know like I think agency and Company are separate yeah they definitely
40:39
can be because especially startup right so with moving from freelance to structure
40:46
um and having a job what did you like about having a job and what did you like about being
40:52
a freelancer I think it goes back to that structure um what I liked about agency so
40:59
like agency life is very agency freelance life is just very difficult right you’re you you’re like
41:06
onboarding I mean when I was at chamber media I was managing anywhere from like 50 to 60 brands at
41:12
a time plus I was managing a team of AD buyers you were managing 50 to 60 brands of like that my team
41:18
also managed oh my gosh but like onboarding those onboarding those people and dealing with people
41:23
constantly like ad buyers having questions because I also manage three or four ad buyers at chamber media and then on top of that you know the companies that they manage and then
41:30
I manage my own small book as well and so it was just like it my days were just like a meeting yeah
41:36
and then I would have meetings with you know the CMO and then like wow it was just like you
41:41
know making sure that budgets are in line and I I kind of started to find like as I started to go more that route I started to not enjoy as much what I originally enjoyed but enjoyed about
41:50
marketing yeah was like the creative aspect like I feel like there’s very data driven marketers and there’s very creative driven marketers and I was I’m very creative driven yeah data is also
41:59
important but to me create like creativity is just like that’s what I love yeah and I love figuring out what works I love figuring out like the the the the emotionally charged funnels
42:09
that get consumers to buy a product or to become you know a fan of your company or your brand or
42:15
whatever it is that’s what I loved and then my job really turned into and I love chamber media it’s a great company and I literally loved everyone oh he was Travis was part of the reason I wanted to
42:26
get into digital marketing oh yeah I was working in digital marketing and saw that he had started chamber media and I thought I could do something similar yeah he was a big inspiration to us and
42:36
I know like they even had a four day work week we have a four day work week oh really yeah so I mean
42:41
well we can talk about maybe that in a second but I’m curious so you literally you yourself
42:47
were are you were you the communication piece and your ad buyers weren’t talking to clients so you
42:53
were you were the one communicating with 50 to 60 Brands no so we had like that was kind of more of an account manager’s chamber media is like it was like a mansion that appeared out of nowhere and
43:03
there was like there was like no Foundation built it was yeah they grew yeah and like when I came on
43:11
when I first started chamber media I was like what in the hell is going on like there was like there
43:17
was not a lot of like because they just blew up so fast they got a lot of like investment money and like there were ad buyers with like 20 clients and then the rad buyers was like none right
43:27
interesting like and it was just like this there was like there was like six managers like one managed like two people another managed like five like it was like so it’s just yeah and um they
43:38
they ended up you know kind of like over hiring and and stuff and but then by the time I left
43:44
um our CMO um core I don’t know if you guys know core iorg but um he really me and him and one of
43:51
the other managers we really helped structure the whole department like pretty well yeah um where it was like there were very clear roles the ad buyers like there was there was no like
44:01
there’s no one really overworked and there was no one really underworked but um sorry so to answer
44:06
your question yeah yeah I uh like I managed my own small book and then I also there’s just a lot of
44:13
communicating with um my advice I manage clients because they would have questions or they would
44:18
want to be with the manager they were more Junior ad buyers and they reported to you yeah yeah yeah but they would still meet with the clients like weekly or bi-weekly or monthly or whatever it
44:27
was I think our sow was bi-weekly but yeah that’s ours too yeah I think it’s pretty common but you
44:33
get those clients are like I want to meet every day and it’s like yeah yeah it’s like no uh do you want me in your account every day maybe but we can’t meet every day and have me do your account
44:42
stuff every day yeah and so there were definitely components I loved about it but once anyways and
44:47
then going going in-house and working at getty uh which is like a crypto decentralized uh wallet
44:55
um it’s been it’s been really nice because now all of a sudden it’s like I I’m back in kind of like
45:00
the creativity Focus like I’m managing testing out like tons of different funnels and tons of
45:08
different social strategies and running ads on trying it here then trying it there and then the crypto space is even more complicated because there’s all these like weird laws and regulations
45:17
and and like Facebook rejects you and they don’t know why and yeah it’s like you know it’s it’s the
45:24
wild west yeah yeah that’s right so that’s been a really um like fun and exciting Challenge and
45:32
in a weird way even though the stakes are higher like I am like less my mind space is more free
45:38
well and I I think like yeah it’s it’s hard to wrap your head around like knowing because I and
45:43
I know we we have quite a few clients like at scroll but I don’t talk to you all close to a
45:50
little over like 200 of them but like having just 50 60 like that you it’s like your soul
45:57
responsibility it’s a lot that’s a lot of just moving pieces then plus you’re managing a team
46:02
this is also I think why like working at an agency is so good for experience like if you want to be
46:08
thrown into the fire and learn very quickly go work at an agency for sure yeah the best yeah
46:14
it’s definitely it’s not for the faint of heart no like the best the best I think the best route
46:20
for anyone who wants to go to marketing or ad buying or or anything like is going to Agency Route yeah for sure because you’ll just you you are you know I’ve worked with like hundreds if
46:30
not thousands of Brands by now and it’s because of agency and freelance work and it’s cool because with each of those Brands it’s like and almost all of it was b2c that’s that’s like what I like
46:40
I’m not I’m not a huge fan of B2B um I like the aspect of like the consumer and like figuring
46:46
out like their psychology yeah like that’s more exciting to me than like B2B stuff but
46:52
um yeah so I anyways I I do love that component I love the whole strategic but when it starts
46:58
becoming more of like I don’t want to say like babysitting but just just trying to put
47:04
out fires all day that’s like what I started yeah it does get rough for sure it’s my job
47:10
um yeah so how did you learn ad buying in the first place you just picked it up on your own
47:16
yeah I just taught myself did you we were reading you have uh you had platform you were on upwork
47:23
and Fiverr and stuff like that yeah I was on Fiverr I was on like the Fiverr like for fiber
47:29
Pro you have to like yeah so I was on that and that was cool like I got some good clients I still I still have clients I manage from that wow but I stopped like promoting it for sure
47:38
um and uh yeah so that was that was fun I still I’m not I’m very picky now if I do take any
47:45
freelance work because my main focus is on getting Kitty and then and then you know here obviously with with John Moore like that’s like off something like one on the side but giddy obviously
47:56
is my primary focus right now on helping them grow and scale that well and it’s nice and I think now like to really hone in and you let your creativity shine and like a full-time role where you don’t
48:09
maybe have as many bounds as you had at the agency yeah exactly sure and I think it’s a very uh
48:15
important thing for listeners to understand is the path you took is one that is so simple for so many
48:25
people that they could follow to reach success in digital marketing yes you work really hard
48:31
and try and learn uh a skill on your own right like you went out there learned how to do media
48:36
buying on your own created freelance profiles to make money where most people would just sit
48:42
there and say like here’s what I want to do and then they don’t know what to do or how to get
48:47
there where you just took action so take action on your own uh create these freelance profiles
48:54
and start to try and get customers it’ll lead to you eventually being able to land a role like a
49:00
director at a big agency where you’re managing ad buyers and companies spending a million dollars
49:06
a month yeah and then it’ll lead you to a place where you could go and focus on a single product
49:12
or a single service where you’re at your house just a really good story that I think can direct
49:18
a lot of people interested in digital marketing to say hey you can figure it out on your own land a
49:24
role where you manage a bunch of people to learn and then land in a spot where you can really let
49:30
your creativity shine and focus on one product at a time for sure and I would also say like never think that you like know what works yes because it’s always changing like it does and you gotta
49:42
you gotta try you have to actually try though and that’s I think what it comes down to you got to try a lot of stuff and you and then once you find what works you can then stay in that lane and
49:52
keep moving forward until it changes again yeah one of my favorite quotes is on my LinkedIn is stay hungry stay foolish I like that you guys have heard that it was given by like a Steve Jobs when
50:02
he was talking to a college I don’t know have you guys seen that wait is that on your profile yeah it is it says stay hungry stay foolish yeah okay I actually saw that recently and I saw on your
50:12
profile and I put it in the notes of my phone oh really yeah I’m just now realizing that was your
50:18
profile oh that’s funny but why do you love that quote so much because I also found it I think it
50:23
can mean different things for different people for me it’s really about I I think I see people that start to like get to a position and they’re like I’m amazing like I’m the boss I know like I know
50:33
it all like I’ve made millions of dollars and I never want to be like that like stay hungry stay flush to me is like like stay humble like stay excited like I think I think my biggest
50:43
um like superpowers are like I’m passionate I’m obsessive which sometimes isn’t good um and I’m very curious like like having those things as an ad buyer and a marketer I think are
50:53
so important because the biggest mistakes I’ve seen marketers get into is when they think that they have it figured out because you’ll never have it figured out no going to a different
51:01
company even if you’re even if you’re in-house at the same company the strategy is going to change like whether it’s a month a year like things are always changing and you always want to
51:09
be testing different things consistently and staying curious staying passionate um and so yeah just stay hungry stay foolish I just I just love that so you think that’s been
51:18
the biggest or yes what do you feel like it’s been the biggest contributor to your success do
51:23
you feel like it’s that Curiosity mindset do you feel like it’s the exploring mindset or do you feel like it’s just your sheer dedication to like the craft of of learning and moving try
51:35
to put in one thing I would say like passion like I’m genuinely passionate about and when
51:40
you’re genuinely passionate about the aspect of figuring out like like what works and then when
51:45
you finally see something that you came up with works or a funnel that you built like generate you
51:51
know a thousand like I well I remember one of the funnels I built for a supplement company got over a thousand percent ROI yeah which is like and they they had not they had been in business for five
52:01
years and not made any they had not made revenue and the second month I took the second month after
52:06
I took over we that we got those results and I was just like seeing stuff like that is like that is so rewarding yeah and so it gives you that high it’s addicting yeah it’s 100 addicting it’s
52:17
like that uh it’s the runner’s high or whatever you know of marketing when you can actually like
52:23
when you really when it really works and then you you actually see it and then you see how
52:29
the client reacts to it it’s everything yeah but you’re never going to get to that point if you’re like I haven’t figured out like this is what works and then if it doesn’t work you’re like well this
52:36
company’s crap like the the you know and it’s like then you you just get prideful and you get stuck in your ways and then you’re not going to progress anywhere I think that’s such a good point because
52:45
I think agencies tend to create a culture that is bad around that where they’ll say this is our
52:51
unique strategy and we only do it this way yeah they’ll say this is how we do it or they’ll say
52:57
um this customer sucks they were the worst they weren’t helpful they were this and that and they just blamed the customer for all these problems yes and think we knew it all and they wouldn’t
53:06
listen uh which I mean sometimes customers don’t listen and it causes problems but the pride of an
53:13
agency can create a downfall for them exactly I think it’s one of the reasons I like chamber as well is like I would I would interview people and we purposely when we interviewed people the most
53:22
important thing was hiring people that were like like entrepreneurial driven like we hired a lot of people that were doing freelance work before or had kind of their own side hustles or things
53:30
like that like we didn’t want to hire the same person like five times like we wanted to hire people with different ideas and different you know strategies that they’ve used and like I
53:40
feel like that type of group is the best yeah yeah and so that was that was the key I remember higher
53:47
I remember interviewing people that had tons of experience um and then hiring people that maybe had a year experience right and I would I would pick people like that over someone with a lot of
53:56
experience that first of of all had that drive that entrepreneurial drive like like there was
54:03
this girl interviewed and she I was like so what are you like doing right now she’s like oh she’s like I do marketing for this company she’s like I I own this and I I do freelance and
54:11
I was like hearing that stuff I’m like you are a hustler and I feel like some companies look at that and they’re like oh it’s a red flag yeah and for for me and I and I and those are the best
54:21
type of people to hire are the people who are just like grinding getting it done not complaining and
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for me I think I think one of the benefits I had coming into the space was I I’ve tried starting three or four different companies and they’ve all failed and so and so I feel like I feel like I I
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realize I’m better at making people money than I’m better at making myself money and you know what sometimes sometimes it is the case yeah you know but I feel like that’s I you know I feel like
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working on agency I would have lots of AD buyers I managed to kind of complain a lot but like oh this they’re being so annoying and it’s like you got to put yourself in their position like they are
54:59
like a lot of these a lot of these startups and stuff they are like this is all their own money like every dollar they’re putting in that’s going into ad buying is like their stuff their stuff and
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so I feel they’ll be feeding their kids this month yeah and so I feel like coming from a perspective that I was in where it was like I was in that spot like it’s I I was able to like respect and relate
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to people and startups a lot more those are my favorite types of companies are like startups
55:21
um and people just like getting going and people that really have a good purpose of why like why they’re doing what they’re doing yeah well I think you hit on a good point
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um you’re really good at making other people money and coming into a system or hiring entrepreneurial
55:37
people and a philosophy that we’ve kind of had at scroll is that entrepreneurial mindset of
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working with being an entrepreneur from within and sometimes that’s the most beneficial route to take
55:49
and there’s uh people are very different in the way they approach things if you hire someone who
55:56
is full-blown entrepreneur and they’re just going to leave in six months and steal all your ideas that that’s one thing but if you can hire someone who has an intranural mindset where they’re really
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dedicated to growing a company from within that’s been our philosophy and being able to say hey we
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have a backbone and we want to be able to funnel you as much money as we can as an entrepreneur
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make it seem like it is your own company from within by giving you uh autonomy to do what
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you want and execute the way you want to do it I love that and that’s and that’s when I when I talk about kind of the restructured chamber media that’s one thing that rcmo pushed a lot was like
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you own your own books and then we implemented the bonus structure which helped a lot right
56:39
um and then he’s motivating yeah yeah money money is always motivating no matter what you do it is yeah for sure and so yeah anyways I just yeah I just I I love it I love the space
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so much I’m constantly learning um I like I said I get bored easily so I feel like if you are a
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type person that gets bored easily or you are very entrepreneurial driven I just feel like marketing the whole creative component to it and it always changing now with the Internet it’s just it never
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gets boring yeah for sure I never get bored with with uh what I do ever I love that so I I think uh
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maybe one or two last questions to kind of wrap this all up today I think one where do you see
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the your future going right now and and then the second question is maybe where do you see digital
57:25
marketing going in the future too because you’ve been in the space for a couple years so I’d love to see like where you think you’re gonna be and where you think digital marketing is going to be
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um where I’m going to be man I don’t know I mean I I right now I’m at I’m at getty and they’re
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they’ve been around for about a year and a half and I was super super excited when they brought me on because they’re in such a good position to just grow and scale and so I really hope
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I’m you know there for the foreseeable future to see them to help them do that um working on agency sometimes it’s people that come to agencies come and go consistently and if
57:57
you do really well for them sometimes they’re like sweet thanks bye yeah and so sometimes it’s hard to like put your name on something and be like I grew this from this to this yeah so to be in-house
58:06
now at a company like I that’s really my goal is to be like I brought this company from making a few thousand to millions of dollars and you know getting all this backing and stuff like that so
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that’s one of my goals um also like starting here uh Brotherhood Co with with John Moore
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um I really want to push that and that’s really been the first kind of business I’ve started where
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it hasn’t been like my purpose of starting it was not Revenue driven it was it was like yeah I was Purpose Driven it was like I’m starting this and if it makes
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money like that would be cool but if it doesn’t like I just want to spread like awareness around mental health for sure and get guys talking and get them communicating
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um and so yeah I would really like you know obviously that to do well and succeed and
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um like I just don’t think I’ll ever stop trying to make things or build businesses or helping
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people or anything like that I love that and then what’s the future of AD buying geez I don’t know
59:05
I that’s that’s what I was talking about is like I just feel like I don’t know I feel like that’s a danger of trying to like predict where things are going oh so well said yeah because it’s
59:14
like that’s that’s I never know that’s one of the biggest mistakes I think companies make is is they they try to look at what everyone else is doing and where the trends are going and nowadays by the
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time you do that you’re too late you’re too late and it’s dumb to look at Nike and see what they’re
59:28
doing and be like I’m gonna play that business model it’s like Nike you can shoot a video of someone like pooping on a toilet in a field and still sell millions of dollars of [ __ ] right
59:37
like it would yeah but it’s just because they’re brand presence yeah I just love when it come to comes on they’re like Nike’s my competitor and it’s like Nike’s not your competitor yeah sorry
59:46
yeah they’re you’re yeah but on their own category the future that is a that’s a hard question I feel
59:52
like the future of it is going to be very unpredictable I feel like it’s always going to be changing um like who knows what’s gonna happen with the whole web 3 space like I have
1:00:01
no idea where it’s all up and coming yeah I have no way that I have no idea where that’s going to go but I think that will play some part you know there’s there’s already like decentralized and in
1:00:09
the sandbox and like the whole Space there where like marketing is starting to happen and that’s totally new and exciting and I think the most important thing is just like staying in
1:00:20
touch with what is happening honestly like these platforms are gonna get so good at ad buying for
1:00:28
you that the only thing that’s going to help you stand out is creative exactly like I I just feel like everything’s starting to be automated like any any like a grandma can go on Instagram and
1:00:37
start like boosting posts and probably get some sales yeah what’s going to set you apart is first
1:00:42
of all like being able to communicate well with people and being able to relate with people and being charismatic right I feel like those are huge underlooked traits of of marketers um and
1:00:53
also yeah always just staying hungry and staying foolish I guess yeah I love that oh he’s just
1:00:59
trying to stay inspired and never thinking that you know everything um yeah I think that that’s
1:01:06
I really don’t know where the future is going but I feel like as long as you’re staying humble and trying to gain inspiration and not trying to steal what other people are doing but using it more as
1:01:15
inspiration and making your own journey is what’s gonna set people apart I love that I think that
1:01:21
that is a great way to format it because it’s the concept of being a humble expert right and
1:01:30
creating your own unique story so a humble expert in this creative and Technical work of AD buying
1:01:38
but also a unique story and a unique why for your brand and vision that makes people interested yeah
1:01:46
so that’s what marketing is about it’s all it’s all about Building stories if you guys ever read uh building a story brand also a really good book yeah super good we’ve talked we’ve I think
1:01:54
that’s the fourth or fifth time we’ve talked about that book that’s probably my favorite
1:02:00
marketing book yeah it’s such a good book and I mean we originally built when we had you until yeah well this has been awesome I think that uh this is great for listeners to understand
1:02:17
that it’s important to be an expert but it’s important to be humble as you grow to stay foolish
1:02:25
um I think that this has been great for people who struggle with mental health and as you come out with here I think it’d be awesome to even have you back on and talk yeah
1:02:34
that would be awesome how that goes maybe dive more into that have you and John we’ll have yeah
1:02:40
hopefully within the next month there should have it it comes rolling a little bit so very cool
1:02:47
and also the conversation of LinkedIn and its purpose and how more people could get involved
1:02:52
there and it’s a really easy opportunity for people for sure yep awesome well thank you
1:02:57
Justin like super appreciate it coming in and uh and talking to us yeah thanks for having me guys it’s been fun thanks it’s gone quick um just to just to maybe finalize it where can
1:03:08
people find you just LinkedIn that’s literally the only place okay so find Justin yep that’s
1:03:14
that’s really the only place I’m active so all right cool okay well it’s been awesome thanks
1:03:21
what’s our sign off Dan I don’t know we gotta come up with that God’s speed is going to be
1:03:26
the it’s going to be the side see on the other side everybody oh yeah keep scrolling right I
1:03:33
like it that’s good yeah welcome to distraction City keep scrolling anyway thank you that’s it
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